Hatred of Police: A Social Commentary

"Dsscats" (dsscats) 10/16/2014 at 15:35 • Filed to: None

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All over the internet (Including Oppo), I've noticed that people have started expressing not just a dislike, but a hatred for police officers. This seems straight up ignorant at this point.

Understand this: Police officers are NOT here to make your life harder. They are here to enforce the laws, which they don't make. If you're doing something against these laws and you get caught, don't say you "hate cops" for ticketing/arresting you. Own up to the fact that you were doing something illegal and you got caught. Cops are not here to make your life harder, but if you do something illegal, you're going to get a ticket.

One of the main examples I see of this recently is H2Oi. Was the amount of tickets being given out excessive? Yes, I'll admit it. But it's absolutely ridiculous for people owning cars which they knowingly modified to be outside the laws calling the cops "douchebags." You knowingly modified your car to be illegal (straight pipes, too low, excessive camber, no front plate, front tint, etc.) and you have no right to complain when you get a ticket for it.

One of the main things I see creating this problem is "The Media" (Yes, I'm going to sound like a crotchety old man for a minute). 95% of the stories about police officers we see on the news now a days are negative. Of course, this is going to leave a negative impression about police, but you can't let the few represent the many. It's the same type of view as when people think that ISIS represents the entire Islamic population.

Again, remember that cops are just here to do their job. They aren't here to make your life harder or pick on you specifically. And police are humans too! Chances are if you're nice to an officer, you won't even get a ticket.

So please, before you say you hate cops, ask yourself why.

Edit: Just to make it clear, I fully acknowledge that there are bad cops out there. There are people out there who don't do there job and can be hard on minorities or certain groups. But there are great cops out there too who will go out of their way to make your life easier. All I'm saying is that it's unfair to let the few represent the many. The good far outnumber the bad.

P.S.: I've also seen someone on the internet bragging about how he "never calls the cops. Ever." He said that he had been stabbed, robbed, attacked at gunpoint and had a car stolen and never called the cops. Maybe there's a reason why you got stabbed and attacked.....

Audi-os, Amigos! > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:37

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Cops are not all assholes, by any means.

But a lot of assholes become cops.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:39

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I'm with you and agree 100%

mcseanerson > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:41

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Only people I know with a good reason for not calling the cops live in places where the quickest response time is an hour and everybody has their own guns.

Diesel > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:41

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I realize that the media cover anything that gets ratings. My issue with police officers is that they seem to be acting more like the military. There's no reason they should be using MRAPs or other high end military equipment when dealing with citizens.

Dsscats > mcseanerson 10/16/2014 at 15:41

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Exactly. If you're an hour away from the nearest police station, it's not exactly helping to wait....

CAR_IS_MI > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:43

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They are here to enforce the laws, which they don't make

THANK YOU!

So many times I have to make this argument with people.

"Well if they don't agree with the law then why don't they just let you go?" they say.

If you don't do a part of your job becasue you don't agree with it, guess what happens to you? You get promoted to citizen / customer / however you like.

mcseanerson > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:44

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These people aren't an hour away but they live in the county which means their only police force is the sheriff's office and on 3rd shift they have 4 officers to cover the entire county. When someone's ex husband is banging on their door waving around a .38 and threatening to shoot them and their kids it's more effective to pick up the 12 gauge than the phone.

CAR_IS_MI > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:45

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Also, I will say, there are such thing as bad cops. It is true, they do exist. They profile and discriminate (not just by race). They are the ones whom often make the news, but they are not the majority (at least of those I've met).

Imirrelephant > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:45

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Understand this: Police officers are NOT here to make your life harder. They are here to enforce the laws, which they don't make. If you're doing something against these laws and you get caught, don't say you "hate cops" for ticketing/arresting you. Own up to the fact that you were doing something illegal and you got caught. Cops are not here to make your life harder, but if you do something illegal, you're going to get a ticket.

In other words...

Dsscats > CAR_IS_MI 10/16/2014 at 15:46

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It's true that there are bad cops, but it's not alright to let the few represent the many.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Diesel 10/16/2014 at 15:50

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I don't think MRAPs are necessary by any means, BUT.

Don't think that military grade weapons aren't needed at certain times.

It's really easy for a criminal to have powerful weapons. And they don't have any complaints about owning illegally modified and/or full auto weapons.

When SWAT teams for major metropolitan areas are properly outfitted and trained I have zero complaints about it.

Also, assault rifles are easier to aim and therefore, more accurate, so its better for them to use those than a service pistol isn't it?

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:51

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I originally come from a town where if something of yours is stolen, the one officer(lol) would be there in 10 minutes. There are good cops out there, but depending on where you live, it can be difficult to find them. I.E.:my current residing state, Florida. The state of "We'll illegally enter your house and shoot your dogs!"

nermal > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:54

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I think a lot of "FUCK THA POLICE" attitude is misguided, and it's easy to avoid negative encounters with police by simply not being a dick, or an idiot, or a combo of the two. Also, ya know, not doing anything illegal.

With the example of H2Oi given, how many of the people being given tickets were idiots that deserved them? For example, doing burnouts? If you're doing something that you know is illegal, either don't do it in public in a heavily policed area, or don't complain if you get a ticket.

It's funny that the biggest complainers are also the biggest instigators. I find it oddly satisfying to see a protester that's being a nuisance and screaming "I KNOW MY RIGHTS!!!" getting a police beat down.

CAR_IS_MI > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:55

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No but thats representative of society; All skateboarders are punks; All black people have guns and rob stores; All Mexicans are cheap, but terrible handymen (that one may be true, still waiting on confirmation); All the rednecks in the south are uneducated hicks whom marry their cousins / siblings; Sales people are swindlers; Accountants are Jewish (this also works in reverse, also Accountant can be subbed for Lawyer);I could go on...

I mean, stereotypes do exist for a reason, but generally they are based on a small group, not the whole.

BigBlock440 > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:56

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What if you're not breaking the law and you still get hassled/taken for a ride in handcuffs? Or call to report arson and they never show up? Or shoot the paper deliverer because they're driving a Japanese truck?

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:56

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Bless this post.

With how close I am to the whole Ferguson debacle I'm starting to hear a lot of people saying fuck the police. Which is not only stupid, but offends me because I have family who are police men and women. They're doing their jobs. They're not out to get you. Quit acting like a dumbass and breaking laws and you wouldn't have a problem.

That said, there can be bad cops. But don't let a few change your opinion on all of them.

Dsscats > nermal 10/16/2014 at 15:58

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And the hilarious part about H2Oi is that there were TONS of warnings that there would be cops there and exactly why (meets without permission of lot owners, burnouts, illegally modified cars, general douchebagism, etclol). People decided to go any ways.

And yes, at a traffic stop, you can refuse to answer questions and remain silent. So many of the people doing this think "I'm exercising my rights as a 'Murrican," but the fact is it'll just make it more likely that you get a ticket.

Sweet Trav > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 15:58

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Sheriffs and Prosecutors rarely get elected for upholding your civil rights, they get elected "by being tough on crime" whatever the fuck that means.

It's not about getting a ticket. It is about a system that rewards being a bully, relying on the pistol on your hip for respect, and expecting your authority to be respected, though TIME and TIME again police are caught misusing their authority.

Give respect to your position, and get respect. I've dealt with enough cops to know the ones that are here to serve and protect, and the ones that are here for an upwardly mobile political career, the furtherment of the good ole boys fraternity of law enforcement and some weird dominant/sadistic tendencies.

Simply put: I don't, and never will trust the police and I question the sanity and intelligence of anyone who does.

Dsscats > CAR_IS_MI 10/16/2014 at 15:59

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Bless this comment.

505Turbeaux > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:00

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I don't hate them, I have plenty of friends that are the fuzz, and they are decent people on and off the job. However there is always a faction of the 5-0 that gets into it for the power trip, and alot of others that are on quota to make money for the city/state/county, as illegal as it is. Those guys are better suited other jobs. I have been fucked with too many times for literally nothing. And I have gotten away with a hell of a lot I shouldn't have, so it balances. However, Dale Earnhardt Jr Jr Jr can go suck a big fat bag of dicks for this comment

I smile every time I see a badge with a black line through it.

Noone deserves that

Dsscats > Sweet Trav 10/16/2014 at 16:00

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But this is exactly what I'm taking about. What has happened in YOUR life (Not from a friend of a friend or on the internet) that is abuse of power from police?

Big Bubba Ray > Logansteno: Bought a VW? 10/16/2014 at 16:01

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You and I are literally at the epicenter for police hatred right now. I can't go more than a couple hours without hearing somebody say "fuck tha police." I want to bitch slap the hell out of everybody who says that.

Dsscats > BigBlock440 10/16/2014 at 16:02

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You can't be arrested "just cause". They may cite an inaccurate reason, so fight it in court! And I haven't heard of anyone being shot for driving a Japanese truck. Link?

Diesel > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/16/2014 at 16:02

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I say this having been former military. I don't think they need all of the things they have been giving access too. For example, the school district that had an MRAP and grenade launchers. What? Anyone can request this too, since the government doesn't want to pay for it's upkeep. Even though, if we do get involved in another war, they will gladly pay full price to build more. It's a waste of taxpayers money, and you are giving equipment to people that have not been trained at the same level. There may be a lot of former military in the police forces now, but you also have the PTSD element and that they were trained to be soldiers first.

ACESandEIGHTS > Diesel 10/16/2014 at 16:02

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Shaved heads, "tacticool" glasses and goatees! What a shock. Too bad the one non-chach, non-bro in this picture has virtually no influence over the rest.

This is exactly what's wrong with police here. Fatigues. Really? Really? If you want to stomp around in combat boots with your M4, why the fuck aren't you overseas doing something useful?

And while I know that cops aren't generally out there to harass, you bet your ass I know they're out to serve the white, the rich, and the powerful. "Token," in that picture above (c'mon, you know who Token is in that pic) toes the white line just as well as any of the white boyz.

Every single person here has known a cop with his head on straight. Every one of us. The ones that care, that enforce when needed, that break up situations and send everyone home when needed, the ones that act like "I live here just like you" instead of "what are you doing here do you live here who are you?" The guy who takes his precinct and his block and his people seriously.

And yet, why is it we know twice or 5 times or 10 times as many who are the opposite, that talk shit, start shit, enforce selectively, profile like mad? You know the ones. The guys that prey on the weak and poor because they're the least likely to say anything and the most likely to do what needs to be done to get out from under the blue specter. If you find one, it doesn't matter who his partner or his squad is, because you can be damn sure he's the dominant force in a given situation.

Whenever I hear about a city that severely limits high speed chases, that disciplines officers and puts the union in check, that straps cameras on cars and cops and fires people who blatantly abuse the camera or the law or the citizenry, or in any other way curtails the police's unchecked power abuses and potential for aggression, I say good start.

Rico > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:03

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Not trying to be rude in any way because I like you Dsscats and I like your posts. But come hang out in the Bronx with me for a while so you can see first hand how shit happens.

I've got stories for days, and while I don't hate cops because some of them are really out there catching the rapists, child molesters, and murderers they are the minority. I've had some great experiences with cops who were genuinely trying to help but I've also been pushed into a gate for walking home then given a disorderly conduct ticket after asking for badge number all the while a Sergeant was telling me to shut the fuck up or I was going to jail for the weekend.

mcseanerson > CAR_IS_MI 10/16/2014 at 16:04

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Courts still out on the salesman one.

Dsscats > Rico 10/16/2014 at 16:05

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Oh no, I understand that there are bad police officers out there. The whole point of this (which you get) is to understand that not all police officers are out to get you or evil.

Diesel > ACESandEIGHTS 10/16/2014 at 16:05

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Thank you. I didn't want to rant on about this, but I agree. I have dealt with several police that were great people. The best encounters I have had were with Highway Patrol Officers. But, I've also dealt with the small town prick that thinks he runs this shit. Pulled over for not wearing a seat belt even though I was. Oh yeah, and how can you tell when we pass at a combined speed of 60, I'm in an SUV compared to your little car and gray seatbelt on gray shirt. The only reason I got out of that was because I was there working with the Mayor. Who, I still let know I had a problem with how his officers were acting.

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > Big Bubba Ray 10/16/2014 at 16:06

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I had a fucking substitute teacher basically say fuck the police! She said we couldn't trust the law enforcement anymore because we don't know what they'll do next!

I'd say it surprised me, but then she racially profiled me as privileged just because I'm white. THAT surprised me.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Diesel 10/16/2014 at 16:07

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Absolutely, that's why I said things like MRAP's are not necessary.

Grenade launchers? that's ridiculous.

I think we're on the same side of this argument.

Sweet Trav > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/16/2014 at 16:08

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I'm going to have to respectfully disagree, if you think one person arriving on the scene with an assault rifle is going to make a difference against a group of criminals with the same, you've seen a few too many action movies.

Police need to be broken down into your beat cops, and armed response teams, stationed like firehouses. Call comes in from dispatch that needs a military-style SWAT presence, send them out.

There's no reason for a beat cop to have a full rock-n-roll M4 in their squad car. I could even go for a semi-auto .308 rifle when more power is needed, but giving them a full military weapon is like giving using a sledgehammer to hang a picture.

SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:09

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There are plenty of reasons to not like cops other than getting pulled over. I've never met one who wasn't a complete scumbag. I've heard that there are good cops, but I don't see them ever doing anything about the bad ones, so I can't verify their existence. I am with the internet bragger you're talking about. I called the cops once, and will not do it again. Even if I'm robbed, I'll fill out a police report after the fact solely because insurance will require it. The back story is that I was mugged in a park that's on a peninsula. Unless you're swimming, there's only one way in and out. It took the cops a half of an hour to show up even though the area is heavily patrolled, within a half of a mile of a substation, and in a populated area. The first prick gets out of the car ready to kick some ass. Has his flashlight in his hand to use as a club, and immediately asks, "So they were all black, right?" I had already explained repeatedly to the dispatcher that they were white. I told him no, they were white kids. He was visibly disappointed and no longer wanted to give chase (not that he had to with the whole one way in and out thing and with the half hour delay on showing up; they just needed one car at that intersection). He tried again with "well, at least one of them was black, right?" This kept going as more cops showed up with the same line of questions. It then dawned on me that all they wanted to do was kick the shit out of some darkies, and that my getting robbed was getting in the way of their doughnut runs or something. They didn't give a shit. Apart from this, I was assaulted at protests when I was more politically active, I've seen people arrested for no reason, and have heard cops bragging amongst themselves about how much they can dick around people during traffic stops. You know what I've never seen outside of New York? Cops helping people. Cops diffusing situations. Their first instinct is to try to do as much damage to someone's life as possible. Cop finds a joint? Guess what? You're live just got derailed for a while. My more professional encounters with them are mostly from when I was working in the film industry. Every bad horror movie has a cop station scene, and most small town cop shops are more than willing to open their doors to something that they think is going to be exciting (it's not). During one of these, someone started talking to the cops about Super Troopers. It turns out that they were all huge fans of the movie and that it was (I shit you not) the most accurate portrayal of what it's like to be a cop. That was the icing on the cake.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Sweet Trav 10/16/2014 at 16:11

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I never said anything about 1 person rolling up on a whole gang.

Just in general, they are more accurate fire arms. We both know this.

And if they're qualified/trained and well practiced with it, I have no problem with them keeping it in the car until it's needed.

Though the idea of your "firehouse SWAT teams" isn't a bad one and I wouldn't be against it.

Zipppy, Mazdurp builder, Probeski owner and former ricerboy > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:12

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I think he meant the Chris dorner manhunt thing a few years ago. innocent paper carriers got shot at (had a truck that did not fit the description, there was also a Honda Ridgeline rammed of the road, also due to them thinking it was Dorner), and the cops had the excuse of taking down a rogue officer.

Reigntastic > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:12

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When seconds count, the police are minutes away.

NaturallyAspirated > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:12

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Here you go:

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Chr…

mcseanerson > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:14

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One night a few years back the police were doing something they referred to as a sting in my city where they pulled over every person with the slightest problem at all with their cars. They did this in an effort to clean up the drugs in our town which at the time was a severe problem and still significant enough to this date that it needs attention. My car at the time was my first car, an 89 Nissan Pulsar with an exhaust leak. I lived on a busy street and street parked. I tried to go somewhere 3 different times that night and I got pulled over 3 different times all within a block of my house by 3 different cops. Each time they were professional and polite and the last one basically told me I should stay home for the night or at least my car should. I have never felt that any officer was unprofessional with me at any point in my adult life. I'm not saying it doesn't happen but generalizing someone because of their career is no better than generalizing due to gender, race, or belief.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:15

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There is a website dedicated to why: http://www.policemisconduct.net/ I guarantee you the ones that were arrested, are out because of a "technicality" and are back at work a week later. It's not the cops, it's the entire justice system. Until that gets fixed, the police hate will get stronger and stronger.

Sweet Trav > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:18

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You must not have grown up in a small town.

Lets see, the 6 months of harassment to the point where my father almost lost his job of 20+ years because he was stopped 2-3 times a week after he got a DUI, paid his fees and successfully completed his probation.

The 5+ times I was improperly stopped in this period because my car was registered in my fathers name when I was doing nothing wrong.

How about my high school friend who is now a county sheriff's deputy and told me "If you ever get pulled just make sure to drop my name. You're on the list "

BigBlock440 > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:20

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No, you can't be arrested, but you can get a rid in the backseat with handcuffs. Also, I believe you can be held for 48 hours without being charged. And the paper delivery shooting was the Dorner manhunt, just threw that one in there for good measure. Point was, even if you're not doing something illegal, you could still end up on the wrong end of the law.

BeMark > NaturallyAspirated 10/16/2014 at 16:35

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Some grade A trolling Lou

area man > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:37

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I get what you're trying to do here, and I don't have a problem with it. However, I do feel like a lot of people who are more inclined to see the bad side of police (due to experience, location, race, what have you) probably understand that not ALL cops are bad and actually there might be a lot of good individual men and women who ARE cops, but believe that the systemic issues and injustices that lead to incidents like Ferguson far outweigh the localized positive impacts of the "good guys." So they see posts and arguments like this as an attempt to silence their main message, not as just as a gentle reminder that #notallcops.

Take your average group of angry Ferguson protestors - will showing them a video of a cop rescuing a civilian from a burning car or saving an old lady from a mean mugger placate them? Of course not, only wide-ranging change that brings about a more inclusive and representative police department will.

NaturallyAspirated > BeMark 10/16/2014 at 16:42

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To be fair, the Police Chief and Police Commissioner did find that the 8 officers involved violated policy, overruling a previous Police panel that had said that the shooting was justified:

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/LAP…

SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 16:43

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Our police force today is seemingly getting more and more aggressive. There were (by my rushed count of a list of police killings) 105 people killed by police officers in August of this year alone (total). From a pretty small amount of internet research, I found this graph that lists some (hopefully) reliable sources. Essentially, the amount of people killed each year is showing an upward trend, though it's important to note that this graph does not show all killings by law enforcement. The total number is likely higher for a number of reasons that I honestly don't feel like getting into.

It's odd that no one really talks about this trend. We talk about situations like Ferguson because they are SO shocking and gain a significant amount of news coverage, but we don't usually talk about how ready police officers are to pull a gun on you. Police in Great Britain, for the most part, don't even carry guns and so their police force kills, on average, less than one person per year (this can be confirmed by a quick Google search). Now, the US population is roughly 5 times larger than that of the UK, so even if you adjust the number of killings to reflect an equal population, that number is still 80 times smaller than the FBI's reported number of US police killings. This is crazy, guys! And its even crazier that once the storm has subsided, we don't talk about.

I'll say it. I generally hate the American police force. There are always good cops, but they aren't doing enough to stop shit like this. Remember stop and frisk? Plenty of cops opposed it, but very few did anything about it. It doesn't matter if you're a good person if you don't actually act like a good person. I don't care what your ideologies are. You could be ethically perfect, but if you don't do anything about it than you are no better than those who are doing the thing you claim to condemn. The good may outnumber the bad, but the bad drastically outnumber the good who don't sit around and take a stand on something like stop and frisk, that weird immigration law in Arizona, or, I don't know, killing unarmed (black) (teen) citizens.

So, yeah, I hate the police but not because of the tickets they've given me. I don't hate them for pulling me over when I was doing something wrong or had a taillight out. Thats not my issue. My issue with the American police force is much larger than that. Fuck the police. Fuck their trigger happy my-safety-is-more-important-than-you-life mentality. While it is true that they are "just doing their job" we often forget that they work for us . We are the shareholders in the company they work for and they are not doing the job I, as a taxpayer, would like to be able to expect.

I'm going to leave you with a video of the British police dealing with a man wielding a deadly weapon. Apparently, after he was apprehended, he was taken to a secure mental health facility where he would've hopefully received the help he needed. If this had happened here, he would've been shot and killed, and no one would've thought twice about it.

Trevor Slattery, ACTOR > ACESandEIGHTS 10/16/2014 at 16:45

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Here, here! I have friends and relatives who are officers and tell them that when the good cops start calling out their shitty cop coworkers, the public opinion will change. But until then...I do not trust cops in traffic stop situations AT ALL.

Tohru > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 17:00

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The David Hooks case is a pretty good case study against calling the cops.

Very short version: A criminal comes on to your property and steals your SUV. Later, the criminal, under the influence of meth at the time of his arrest, tells the police that he found drugs on your property. The police proceed to obtain a fraudulent and illegal search warrant, sneak on to your property, and - without announcing themselves - break down your back door. Frightened that the criminals have returned to your home, you retrieve a gun to protect yourself and your spouse. The police then open fire and you are killed in your own home. By the police.

http://www.policemisconduct.net/the-david-hook…

BeMark > NaturallyAspirated 10/16/2014 at 17:18

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We have to be fair, especially for the 8 guys who 'violated policy' while executing the use of deadly force . I mean food workers get fired for not washing after using the head.

"It will be up to Police Chief Charlie Beck to decide how, if at all, to discipline the officers, who have been assigned duty out of the field. "

Also we shouldn't forget how the department tried to essentially buy them off with a new truck with the stipulation that if they took it they could never sue.

Like most on here I have really good friends on the force so it's sort of a catch 22. Yeah the guys I know are good people but then you see how LEO's deal with their own (very small minority of bad cops) and it just makes you a little uneasy. You see way more news articles about Officers who got caught doing something wrong because somehow it was on tape or the violation was so gross it had to be investigated by prosecutors. In all those cases those bad cops are almost never turned in by their peers.

I support LEO's and have respect for the job but if we want to fix our nations police forces we need a serious over hall of Internal Affairs and general accountability. Yes the job is hard but that is exactly why they should be held to a higher standard.

Rico > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 17:51

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Here's an experience that happened to me a few years ago that might help make my feelings toward police even clearer, me and my friend were once lost in Yonkers trying to get back to the Bronx. After taking a number of wrong turns a cop flipped his lights on and pulled up along side us.

He asked us if we were lost and we said we were and he said to just follow him and he'll lead us back to the proper highway after saying thanks I turned to my friend and said "Is he really going to help us?" And he was like "I think so". And he did! Led us back to the highway and waved to us as we went past, it was surreal. But the thing is it shouldn't feel surreal it should feel normal, there's times where I walk past cops knowing I'm doing nothing wrong but still feel nervous and try to not "look suspicious". Shouldn't be that way though.

And I've had great experiences with cops. One day I was looking out my window and saw a lady park her minivan and keep walking, she locked it via the remote but for some reason all her windows lowered and she kept walking! I ran out to tell her but she was gone.

It was mid day and it looked like it was going to pour so I did what I thought was right I grabbed a few huge garbage backs and painters tape and went out to cover her windows (it had already started drizzling) while I was out there a cl patrol car pulled up and I explained what I was doing, the cops not only helped me tape the windows but also tracked down the owner about an hour later (it was pouring raining) and brought her from her location nearby to her car. I couldn't thank the officers enough, not for helping but for being 100% professional.

 > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 17:52

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Cops job isn's only to enforce the laws. It's to collect revenue for the city. Plus cops make shit up to try to find any reason to bust you.

For example someone gets pulled over for speeding and cops ask to search the car. When the person refuses they start asking stuff like "why don't you let us search it, do you have something to hide?" Shit like that is what pisses me off about cops. Do your job according to the law and don't try to come up with bs to bust people on.

desertdog5051 > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 18:07

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Tired of reading all the comments yet? I have seen both sides of this and like any other large group, there are always the good and the bad.

offroadkarter > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 18:15

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I'll be 100% honest, I don't trust the police for shit, and I'm always afraid any time I get pulled over that "this is the moment I end up in a police brutality video". Cops can legally get away with a lot more shit than you or I can, including seizing your cash and claiming it was related to drugs.

One of the departments near me has had multiple officers arrested in the past couple of years. One was arrested in a prostitution sting setup by a neighboring township, one was arrested for firebombing his supervisors house, one was arrested for robbing a bank on his way to start his shift, and recently 3 were arrested for plotting a revenge scheme on a fellow officer from another township for arresting one of their own.

I know they aren't the ones to blame for the laws but sometimes their discretion isn't the best either.

rb1971 ARGQF+CayenneTurbo+E9+328GTS+R90S > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 18:35

0

I'm a relatively affluent white person living in a big city. Almost all of my interactions with police officers have been positive, including when someone broke into my house when I was home. (I now have a shotgun in case that happens again.)

So you'd think I'd love the police, but I don't. I think individual police officers are pretty good, even most of them. So why do I hate the police as a whole and most police forces institutionally? It's probably because of some or all of the following:

1. Relatively continuous violation of constitutional rights especially related to searches. Mostly in situations where it is obvious the officer has more knowledge of consent laws than the person from whom consent is being "requested".

2. Over-militarization, including overuse of "no knock" warrants.

3. Way too many police shootings (likely partially a product of #1 and #2).

4. The "blue wall of silence" that makes it so much more difficult to weed out the bad apples.

5. Harassment of photographers and videographers, and generally refusing to turn on cameras and/or destroying videotape evidence.

Bonus points: "Suspended with pay." This should literally NEVER happen. I would be ok with officers being reinstated with back pay, or not suspended for small infractions (which I don't think happens anyhow), but this reads way too much to the general public like "on vacation". Isn't there paperwork at the precinct these folks can do? If not, grab a broom and start sweeping (apologies to George Carlin).

oldirtybootz > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 18:41

0

My father is a cop in Queens, so it's not that I hate cops, but the local PD are a bunch of overpaid douche bags.

Frosted > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 18:45

0

I have a massive respect for police officers after attending a junior police camp when I was in middle school (the kind where they let you sit in the car and watch them shoot paper targets at their shooting range, one for little kids ya know). I like their cars a lot too. So much that I collect various models of them.

Being a police officer is a pretty scary job, constantly worrying whether the person in that minivan you pulled over is gonna the last person you ever pull over has to be absolutely terrifying. I used to ride for a local township volunteer ambulance service as a first responder. We had an older lady call one night for something or other. The house we needed to get to was where a potentially dangerous man also lived (he's threatened police and pulled a katana on EMTs in the past). Cops went in before us, guns drawn. Scary shit, not knowing what they'd find inside and needing to run in quickly. GG Police, you do a good job keeping the community safe where I'm from.

AlForno > Diesel 10/16/2014 at 19:56

1

And the attitude of us against them that they seem to have. They are there to serve society not combat the enemy.

ly2v8-Brian > SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) 10/16/2014 at 21:01

0

But is an uptick in police related deaths a result of modern crime? Are the criminals on a case by case basis getting more violent in the face of the cops, resulting in a more violent police force out of their own protection? Or is it just simply a change in attitude after 9/11, that means they must be hyper vigilant, creating a more stressful atmosphere? There are many questions.

MountainCommand > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 21:13

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My counter to the h20i debacle with police enforcement is this. Im confused how the legality works. Ill do some research but here goes my logic:

If car A from lets say the state of Georgia, comes to OCMD to visit, is car A suppose to magically conform to the laws of MD? If georgia doesnt require front plates, no tint limit, no emmisions, or no safetey inspection (and there are no laws about excessive suspension modifications), then how can MD enforce tickets for tint, plates, emissions, etc for an out of state vehicle. Car A was registered and insured and plated in Georgia. Not MD. Now if car B was from MD, and went to H20i, he is subject to his states laws and enforcement of them. You see where this line of questionable legality comes in? What right do LEO have to enforce laws upon non residents of the state, specifically concerning motor vehicles. I have another example:

My dad got pulled over in TN just recently. He has NJ plates and his car is still registered and insured in nj. The officer pulled him over for having no sticker on the license plate. If youre in NJ, you ask yourself: what sticker? We dont have any stickers?! NJ has no expiration sticker on license plates. Tennessee does. It may give the cops a reason to pull you over, and then ticket you for other unsafe behavior or things like cracked windshield, but if the cop gave my dad a ticket for not having an expiration sticker on his license plate, when NJ doesnt require it, that ship should sink the day it sails into court. Enforcing that law on him makes no sense! (im gonna make a post about this right now actually)

"But it's absolutely ridiculous for people owning cars which they knowingly modified to be outside the laws calling the cops "douchebags." You knowingly modified your car to be illegal"

Well, in another state, all of that could have been legal!

If i go visit california, do i have to pull over at the neveda border and fit SMOG equipment on my car to make it legal to drive in your state? Will your cops ticket me for a non smog compliant car knowing i am from out of state?

My last example. I ride a motorcycle. In NJ bikes do not have to go through any inspection. period. All you need is registration and insurance. If i go to another state that has motorcycle inspections and require bikes to have inspection stickers, can they give me a ticket?

So to come full circle. Was it legal for all those police officers to ticket OUT OF STATE cars with their supposed excessive camber. The only way i see it working is if it somehow falls under similar scrutiny of a tail light out, or a broken windshield.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Dsscats 10/16/2014 at 22:15

0

I've negative interactions with officers and as well as positive ones. I consider that my summation of all groups, professions, etc.

Racescort666 > Imirrelephant 10/17/2014 at 00:16

1

I don't hate cops when I get busted for speeding, that's my own damn fault.

SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) > ly2v8-Brian 10/17/2014 at 03:20

2

It really doesn't matter why. Police are getting more violent. They are held to a higher standard than common criminals, so the actions of violent criminals should not validate killings by police. If criminals are getting more violent in the face of the police, I would be willing to argue that it is likely because of a common distrust of police due to excessive force and shooting-to-kill being common themes. If a normal citizen who is doing nothing wrong can't trust the police, and if police shoot down citizens who are unarmed, criminals are effected the same way. Cops walk up to people with their hands on their guns, and starts acting hostile, one main thought that is likely going through a criminal's head is likely "(s)he's not going to arrest me, (s)he's going to shoot me." Criminals and cops have adopted the same mentality. Shoot first, ask questions later. That may be fine for those who are living outside of the law, but for those who are meant to be protecting the citizens in their jurisdiction it is unacceptable.

And if by hyper vigilant you mean overly paranoid and trigger happy, than maybe.

There are many questions, and we as a society aren't asking the right ones.

Connor Jones > Dsscats 10/17/2014 at 06:42

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totally true. I'm 18 have been pulled over twice (right-fully so both times) and did not receive a ticket either time. The second time the cop had to give me a jump start so I could get my car home (long story that I can elaborate on if anyone is interested, basically my heater core exploded while I was being pulled over, and my alternator was dying) Anyways, I was polite and respectful, apologized for what is was I got pulled over for, and got off fine both times. There is no reason to complain about cops most of the time. There is no way I could do their job well. I don't handle needlessly rude people well.

Connor Jones > SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) 10/17/2014 at 06:59

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This was a really interesting post. However, at risk of sounding callous, if I was faced with a decision where an armed criminal was threatening me, I would probably shoot first and ask questions later, I would shoot to kill as well. I'm not a cop, and I probably couldn't handle their job, but if I'm ever faced with a decision that looks like it will quickly become him or me, I will choose me every time. So for the most part I don't have a problem with officers using deadly force. You also have to remember that the British and American cultures are very different. Especially on how the view firearms in their societies, we have built ours with a right to bear arms that just doesn't exist almost anywhere else. What works in other countries may or may not work in the U.S. I've been watching a lot of the old worlds wildest police videos episodes, and I am constantly surprised by the number of incidents where an officer could have justified defending themselves with deadly force but chose not to. I suppose these videos are designed to show the officers in a good light, but if there are that many videos of officers making that choice, I would argue that is the majority. I definitely agree however that many police forces now have equipment that is completely unnecessary. I do believe that officers should be armed though.

Connor Jones > MountainCommand 10/17/2014 at 07:06

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Totally agree. The aftermarket muffler the previous owner of my car fell off, and since my car is registered in Elbert county CO, where there is no emissions testing, I just put an 18 inch exhaust extension on it. I can't be ticketed for it while I'm at school in Utah where it is illegal to go without a muffler, as long as my car stays registered in Elbert County, and I maintain residency in CO. If i get pulled over for it , I can explain where my car is registered, and I cannot get a ticket for it, period. (as long as it's under 120 db, which it is as it's an audi a4)

Connor Jones > SidewaysOnDirt still misses Bowie 10/17/2014 at 07:16

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I'm sorry you haven't ever had good experiences with cops. All of the ones I've dealt with have been at least polite and respectful, I guess I'm biased as I personally know two of them. Nothing could be more set to make you dislike cops than your experiences, so I'm not going to try to dissuade you, but just say that you can't validate there are good cops because the system isn't getting better seems awfully harsh to me, as what are a few cops supposed to do to improve it other than follow the laws to the best of their own ability? Sometimes there is truly nothing you can do other than attempt to be the best you can be and hope others notice, at least then you will help a few people. It's like that story where a person walking along a beach was throwing beached starfish back into the ocean, when a man walked up and said he wasn't statistically making a difference, the man picked up a starfish, tossed it into the ocean and said "just made a difference to that one". Our best effort is all we can give, even if our work isn't statistically noticed, it makes a difference to someone, even if it's only ourselves.

merkyg > Dsscats 10/17/2014 at 07:31

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I don't think they're all bad, although I don't know how people do that job unless they agree with all the laws they are enforcing (don't understand cops who smoke weed for example, bit hypocritical). There's certainly an element of them that were bullied at school and haven't got over it, and the amount of cops shooting peoples dogs out of anger seems to be crazy recently. They've been reasonable 95% of the time I've encountered them and I know a few (GFs brother was pleased when we bought a Saab as he'd just been called out to a smash where a 9-5 drove head on into a truck at around 70 - old guy, zoned out - and the occupants had been ok). The problem is at least in the UK they are SO patronising in the way they deal with people. I realise lots of people are idiots and need things explained in that cop manner, but hey, don't use that as your default way of talking to people. Mind you, they're mostly not armed over here so there is less potential for things to go south when you get a really bad cop. I don't have a problem with them if they have a sense of humour and aren't just trying to fuck with people out of boredom or some 'respect mah authoritaah!' BS. Depending where they are, I imagine that can be a horrendous job.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Diesel 10/17/2014 at 08:09

1

The other thing that one has to consider is what defines "military grade". Or more directly, how it is defined.

Because one could take the stance of, oh, say, Mexico or Italy, and not allow any caliber of weapon to be owned by the general populace that is purchased by the military.

9mm Parabellum? Nope, you can't have that because the military carries M9A1s. Which is why Beretta sells the Beretta 98.

Which to those of us in the US, comes across as patently ridiculous.

However, the militarization of the police is not something to be dismissed out of hand. The military tends itself to be more towards an "Us vs. Them" mindset, as opposed to the nominal policing "Protect and Serve."

Sir Robert Peel would be disgusted by the 5-0 rolling around in MRAPs.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Dsscats 10/17/2014 at 08:19

1

My objections are based on the 9 Principles of Sir Robert Peel, creator of the Metropolitan Police in London.

Specifically Principle 7:

Police, at all times, should maintain a relationship with the public that gives reality to the historic tradition that the police are the public and the public are the police; the police being only members of the public who are paid to give full-time attention to duties which are incumbent on every citizen in the interests of community welfare and existence.

The problem is that the policing strategy has been to go so far beyond this to the point of insanity. It's not helped that certain factions of the political landscape only think "But if we had more cops..." DOING WHAT? They can't answer that question.

Hence I refer to Principle 9:

The test of police efficiency is the absence of crime and disorder, not the visible evidence of police action in dealing with it.

But that implies politicians cannot parade around for the cameras with the new shiny cadet class and equipment purchased from the DOD.

However, you indirectly refer to Principle 3, which I agree with:

Police must secure the willing cooperation of the public in voluntary observance of the law to be able to secure and maintain the respect of the public.

But that's not going to change until we deal with how the law treats individuals. And that's a huge political minefield.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Sweet Trav 10/17/2014 at 08:21

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but giving them a full military weapon is like giving using a sledgehammer to hang a picture.

It's possible to do, but about 10 times harder than it needs to be.

Sweet Trav > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 10/17/2014 at 08:22

1

When someone gives you a big hammer, you immediately look for something to use it on...

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Dsscats 10/17/2014 at 08:29

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You can be arrested assuming the officer feels there is probable cause that you have committed a crime. Any crime.

Plus the answer isn't "fight it in court", because that takes Time, Money, and sometimes, Lawyers (Which is a special case of Time and Money).

And not a lot of people have Time and Money to spend on frivolous charges. Police have immunity as long as they are acting within the scope of their duties (sometimes this is limited to Qualified Immunity), so you cannot sue for damages if they harass you (arresting lawbreakers is part of their duties, and they charge that you are a lawbreaker).

Perhaps being a little more zealous with malicious prosecution and limiting immunity of the department as a whole might at least return some semblance of accountability to their actions.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > area man 10/17/2014 at 08:32

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Of course not, only wide-ranging change that brings about a more inclusive and representative police department will.

That won't solve the issue. The problem is one of accountability for actions. Officers have immunity as government officials. Perhaps corporate liability for violating rights that would have been known to a reasonable individual might bring some accountability back to policing, and help the public trust and work with the police...

Just as Sir Robert Peel intended.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > Sweet Trav 10/17/2014 at 08:34

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When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

Conan > Dsscats 10/18/2014 at 01:11

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I don't hate the police. They're mostly decent people trying to get by. I hate some of those who make them do what they do and have the questionable resources they have.

Zibodiz > Dsscats 10/19/2014 at 00:57

2

I know this will rile some people up, but I'm being honest, and basing my views strictly on personal experience. I hope I don't make any enemies with this post (I doubt anyone will read it, since this article is a couple days old, but still), but I don't feel that I can let this one rest.

I call it like I see it, as I assume most intelligent people do. Sure, there are people who base their beliefs on what they read on the Internet, but I give people the benefit of the doubt and assume they speak from experience.

For a long time (i.e., until I got my driver's license and started interacting with police), I believed only the best about them. I actually wanted to eventually become a police officer. But after turning 16, I realized that police are NOT your friends.

I don't know the reason (whether it was profiling based on my age & gender, my car, something personal, or what), but I was pulled over *literally* every week for about a year, until I moved to a different part of the state. I was driving a 30-year-old hooptie with no muffler (that's completely legal here), and worked nights, so I'd be on the road at Midnight coming home, but I was literally getting pulled over every time a cop saw me. I got tickets for everything you can think of, often with no truth behind the allegation.

Since that time, I've had numerous other encounters with cops in different types of situation, and the experience has always been similar. For instance, I called to report vandalism in action at the city park, and immediately became a suspect. A year or two later, I called to report a cash box I'd found while walking in the woods. I didn't touch it, because I knew it had to be stolen, but instead I immediately called the cops. They showed up and threatened to arrest me, since my footprints were the only ones nearby, which obviously means I did it (why would I report myself?)

Then there was the time recently when a cop lied about me to a judge (I really don't want to go into it, but suffice to say; I've been acquitted, since it was all a lie, and I proved it. Not vehicle related.)

There's an analogy I heard recently that seems to fit: You may just be a secretary doing paperwork, but if you're a secretary at Auschwitz, you're still guilty of murder. The cops may not all be bad, but I've unfortunately been targeted by over a dozen that have at the very least abused their power, and may be much worse. At what point does 'doing their job' become 'aiding and abetting' the misdoings of those in the wrong? When does an officer need to take a stand and say "No, I'm not just going to 'do my job', I'm going to do what's right."? More to the point; how many bad cops do there have to be before we're allowed to profile them, like they profile us?

Furthermore, there's another aspect that is all too often ignored. The police are not here to serve or protect you . They're here to enforce laws — laws that are specifically to oppress/restrict you*. The police exist to serve and protect the government and its interests . Case in point: I was in an accident with someone who did not have a license or insurance. The police arrested her and forced her to pay hundreds of dollars in tickets. She owes me $3800 for damages to my car, but she's never going to pay. You know why? Because the police take money out of her paychecks every week for her tickets. I can't take any money out of her paychecks until all of her tickets are paid off. It's been about 4 years since that time, and I still haven't gotten a dime. Do the police care? No, they're just here to serve and protect the government.

And don't even get me started on Civil Forfeiture. That's enough of an epidemic that foreign countries have travel advisories against spending time in America, because cops will rob you if they get the chance. I'm sure you saw that in the news a couple weeks ago.

There is a lot of distrust of police for good reason. Sure, there are some good people who work on the force; I personally know a couple of them. But in my experience, the less-than-good cops greatly outnumber the good cops.

*Laws exist to oppress. Whether they're good laws or not, they're always to oppress, never to benefit. Laws take away our ability to do things; they tell us what we cannot do. That's just how laws work. There's no 'serving' the public there. Just 'restricting' — or 'oppressing' — the public. I'm not saying that's necessarily a bad thing, just calling a spade a spade.

thebigbossyboss > Rico 10/20/2014 at 12:40

1

Wow that's quite nice of you I probably would not have gone to such length.

thebigbossyboss > ly2v8-Brian 10/20/2014 at 12:43

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Crime in America, in general has been falling for the best part of 10 years now.

ly2v8-Brian > thebigbossyboss 10/20/2014 at 12:48

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Yes it has, but I'm talking about the individual criminals. Have they gotten more aggressive/desperate against the cops?

thebigbossyboss > ly2v8-Brian 10/20/2014 at 12:54

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Not sure. Not sure how one would measure that.

ly2v8-Brian > thebigbossyboss 10/20/2014 at 14:12

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It's a chicken and egg thing really. Which is the result of which?

As far as hard data goes, go to the FBI. They keep very good records of crime for the entire nation. But remember correlation does not equal causation, the data can only tell so much.

One thing seems certain. That police work drastically changed in the 60's and 70's, what you see now is a continuation of that. Not to mention things such as the LA bank robbery (criminals in full body armor, like almost EOD levels of armor, and full auto AKs) and the major terrorist attacks in OKC (domestic) and 9/11 (foreign).

I leave you to analyze the data to come up with an informed and all around understanding of just how grey all this is.

JDIGGS > Dsscats 10/20/2014 at 16:42

2

Understand this: Police officers are NOT here to make your life harder.

Um thats exactly what they do?

Obviously you have had the pleasure of living somewhere with decent police. I have not. I have seen all kinds of insane things in the last 10 years.

People hate cops because it's a brotherhood, and most police are too cowardly to do the right thing. They do what suits them when they want and they get away with so much. Police simply do not abide by the law, and then they wonder why everyone hates them and has no respect for them.

They want you to play by the rules when they don't themselves. It's pretty simple.

JDIGGS > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 10/20/2014 at 16:47

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Yeah a lot of training to go fight in the middle east, but the guys who were 1) too lazy 2) not capable to joined the armed forces police our own people with minimal training at best. Why do cops need to be as armed as our soldiers in war but not be trained?

The United States chooses to set the attitude / tone of interactions with the public by teaching aggressive reactive tactics. If you have ever been to a crowded event with armed police somewhere in Europe you realize just how much of a Police State the US is.

JDIGGS > Diesel 10/20/2014 at 16:52

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Cops simply do not know how to do or solve anything other than with their guns and aggressive physical actions. Instead of working with people cops go out of their way to push buttons, it's how they are trained.

If police were forced to do at least somethings without weapons and intimidation maybe the police could actually clean the country up, and people would feel safe when they see them instead of scared.

It's sad.

timgray > Dsscats 10/20/2014 at 18:34

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"Understand this: Police officers are NOT here to make your life harder. They are here to enforce the laws, which they don't make."

Understand THIS.. Police are there to SERVE and PROTECT. not act like they are more important or holier than anyone else. They need to keep their mouths in check and say SIR and MADAM/MISS to everyone and be as police and courteous as possible.

Pulling a gun on ANYONE had damn well have a reason to be fearing for their life.

It seems that cops Forget their OATH a lot lately.

timgray > Dsscats 10/20/2014 at 18:37

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But the "good cops" don't turn in the Bad ones. They look the other way because of the good old boy network and the union.

I have a good friend that turned in a dirty cop. He accidentally got shot in the head (he survived and has a lot of problems) by another officer right after that.

OttoMaddox > Dsscats 10/20/2014 at 19:06

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This is why I hate them:

The Justice Dept. got all over Seattle Police Dept. for their use of excessive force, and demanded reforms. SPD has been fighting these reforms ever since, with officers claiming that it gives criminals rights over officers. That ignores the fact that many of the excessive force cases were against innocent bystanders or those accused of non-violent offenses.

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/Jud…

That seems to be the common justification with the cops. They're "afraid" so they brutalize the population in response. That's cowardice. And a lot of their violence might be the result of steroid abuse:

http://www.policechiefmagazine.org/magazine/index…

Of course they can brutalize us with utter impunity; thanks to the "thin blue line" and the acquiescence of the courts and state and local governments.

So yeah, I hate the police and the whole rotten system.

OttoMaddox > SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) 10/20/2014 at 19:25

1

Contrast that video with this one:

SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) > OttoMaddox 10/20/2014 at 19:28

0

Hmmm. It's not showing up for me for some reason. What should I google to find it?

EDIT: Just kidding. Its working. How unfortunately typical.

And Dsscats wonders why people hate the police. Have I ever been shot at by a cop? No, but that doesn't mean I can't or shouldn't hate them for shit like this.

Have you seen Fruitvale Station? I would highly recommend it if you haven't.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > JDIGGS 10/21/2014 at 11:29

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Well, don't assume either one of your first or second points, it's not really fair to an entire career field.

Cops sometimes need to be armed with high-powered weapons because in the US citizens (and criminals specifically) can go to the store and just BUY high-powered weapons.

That's why I said they are only needed at certain times. No they don't need to walk up to your car on a 7 mph over speeding pull over with an M4, but it might not be a bad idea to have one in the trunk.

The majority of cops that have a video camera on them due certainly have an aggressive/intense attitude and tone. That's not a representative of ALL police officers though.

They are certainly also trained in non-lethal actions, such as tasers and pepper spray.

The police do more than you think, and more non-violent things than you think.

Just like how all the nightly news channel's do is play the "terrible things that happened today" The cops doing good things and non-violent things never make the news, it doesn't get viewers and it doesn't get clicks on websites.

SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) > Connor Jones 10/21/2014 at 13:59

1

Right, and I believe, faced with a life or death situation, so would I. But neither of us are cops (I, too, would never be able to handle that job) and cops cannot be held to civilian standards or else what's the point? They have plenty of options. Shoot to stop (like shooting for the legs), tasing, or any number of other possibilities. The fact that police are so quick to draw they gun instead of their taser is a problem in the first place, and the fact that they are just as quick to let off a few rounds is completely unacceptable for law enforcement of any kind. If they tased twice as many people as they kill per year, I would have absolutely no issue with that. I have no issue with using force if it is necessary, but I do have an issue with excessive force and a HUGE issue with the use of deadly force If they feel that they need to use force on a "perp" so be it, but killing the prime witness in your own trial is not something that would fly for any other civilian. As to your point about our view on guns, it is a very split issue. I'm taking a few law classes and our right to bear arms is... interpretable. In our constitution it states:

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed

And that could mean any number of things. We actually had a discussion on whether or not this should be interpreted as "have all the guns you want" or "during a time of crisis when regulated militias are necessary, citizens must be able to be armed and ready at all times." It was a very interesting discussion with good points (and huge holes) on both sides, but we must also realize that our constitution is in no way a holy document. We can change it, amend it, or toss it out if we wanted to. Seriously, if we wanted to throw away the constitution tomorrow and start anew, we could. We set that president when we threw out the Articles of the Confederation, which was a move of shaky legal grounds to say the least. If our government somehow all agreed on banning all guns, they could. In fact, our congress would be able to ban the SALE of guns without changing the constitution, though they cannot ban guns as a whole without doing so.

I'm not arguing for one or the other, because I think there are definite pros and cons to both sides, but gun rights are immensely more complicated than "it's our right." While it is a right given to us my our constitution, it is not an unalienable right by any means.

I also think it should be noted that I personally do not hate cops. I've had some aggravating experiences with the police (more so than the type of aggravation the Dsscats is talking about) and an incident where a police officer acted completely out of line and illegally searched my car. In that instance, I knew to sit down and shut up. I didn't have anything illegal in the car and I knew I wouldn't get in any sort of trouble, but what if I had protested? What if I had shown how pissed off I was? Would he have shot me? Probably not. I am white, after all. But you never know, and that's the problem here. You're supposed to trust police officers with your life and you simply can't do that for any random cop.

And I know plenty of officers who are stand up guys. My neighbor was a cop (he's since moved. Still a cop) and he had a moral code like I have never seen. It was a beautiful thing to see. My uncle is an officer, too. He does a great job and works in a bad area where he's in constant danger just for wearing his uniform, but he hasn't pulled his gun once, even when he could have justified it, because he knows that talking to someone is much easier when there isn't a deadly weapon in between you. He has plenty of stories of cops who completely abuse their power or are generally assholes to civilians, and that's from his time in just one department. This whole thing is probably too difficult of a subject to really talk about online, but it is an important one. There is much more to be said than I am willing or able to type out here, but I'll leave you with another video that someone else posted. It's situations like this one that make people hate cops, not the petty bullshit Dsscats is pointing out. If you hate cops for giving you a ticket, Dsscats is right. You're an ignorant asshole. But if you hate the American police force (which is a very importance distinction) for how they act in cases like this, you have every right to be.

P.S. Sorry my response was so delayed. I though I had responded to this a couple of days ago. My bad!

Connor Jones > SmoresTM Has No Chill (O==[][]==O) 10/23/2014 at 05:07

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I'll admit, I didn't read all of your reply. I read most of it, and I certainly agree with you on most of it. The one where I disagree is shooting to wound. It is very difficult to shoot to wound. You run the risk of missing and hitting people/objects behind your target. You have to shoot center of mass, or drawing your weapon is practically useless. But you have obviously given this a lot of thought, and I appreciate that you didn't just tell me i was "wrong" as so many do on topics they feel strongly about. I do agree that non-lethal methods should be used whenever possible.

Connor Jones > Connor Jones 10/23/2014 at 05:11

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I also was referencing the american culture, not our constitution, the argument there doesn't really matter with the point I was trying to make. Because our 2nd amendment right has in the past been interpreted as a right to bear outside of a militia, that is the way I though of our american gun culture. But you're right, the way the 2nd amendment is written (especially the placement of the commas, I feel) definitely is debatable.